This makes me so angry. No one forces you to go against your conscience. If all the NHS had used their moral compass the jabs would have had to be withdrawn.
I feel angry about this! I lost my job, my 20 year marriage, 99% of my friends AND my family. I now only have my 2 adult children (in their 20's) and one friend in my life. I am a heart beat away from being homeless. This doctor was NOT FORCED just cowardly, weak and immoral.
You’re missing the point. He is describing his working conditions. He’s a doctor whose focus is healing, why would he not continue to help patients? How would walking away help them?
I am so, so sorry you have been through this awful experience and have lost so much. Please know that your stand and your commitment to ethical practice is not only commendable, it is meaningful to a great many people, even if they are people you don't personally know. I wish you the best going forward and I sincerely hope good fortune is just around the corner for you.
I respectfully disagree, Edwin. I believe you are correct in your assertion that doctors like the one here are (currently) "too few in number and need (y)our support", but I do not agree they were forced to behave differently. I welcome all healthcare professionals (and indeed all people) who begin to question the appallingly cruel measures taken in the name of pandemic management, but I do not believe that automatically allows them to divorce themselves from their previous involvement, however sad this involvement may make them.
They had a responsibility to show up to work for every shift this last three years- and they did… when they weren’t poorly (or assymptomatically poorly…).
There has been no time to take a stand on PPE and isolation.
The battle right now is on the floor, amongst staff members who do not yet perceive anything wrong.
Some doctors did their very best to carry on with well mannered, principled conduct, addressing serious issues in people’s lives. They were overwhelmed with infrastructure and policy .
Of course, these sorts of matters usually are. What I am saying, and what I think others here are saying (if I may be so bold as to assume) is that these healthcare workers could have left their jobs rather than participate in these measures in the day-to-day functioning of their roles. I am not suggesting we should not keep such people "on side" as they begin to question or lament the measures, quite the contrary. I am simply acknowledging that regret does not allow a person to undo previous actions. I include myself in this assessment; no one is perfect or blameless, but guilt does not undo past actions. Having said that, I do agree that genuine remorse is a very meaningful position.
No. I will never trust so called doctors again. If those that 'knew' had made a stand then this might have looked different for everyone. Despicable and cowardly. While the rest of us lost everything
Like this- everybody is tricked into FEELING guilt for their very presence.
Their breath is toxic and they are at risk of the sin of contagion. They have been beaten into infection control submission. They have chosen to avoid anyone else’s personal space. The majority don’t even know it yet.
This called HABITUATION in biology - it’s a form of conditioning which may as well be seen as coercive force.
To be honest I am exhausted! Along with so many others I have been treated with contempt and hatred for the last few years. I am now picking myself back up mentally, emotionally and physically. I was classed as 'extremely vulnerable' due to not having a spleen and have been treated abominably by my own doctors surgery because I chose to ask appropriate questions. I am in my 50's and I feel like a whole lifetime of trust and belief has been destroyed. If these so called doctors ever get to claim 'moral injury' and get paid for the harm it has done them, I will be beyond furious. I am now a full time carer for my vax injured ex husband who is still asleep to it all!!
I concur with the sentiments expressed here by many people, some of whom have lost everything. I was a nurse in Australia and was utterly horrified by the vast majority of so-called pandemic management measures. I left soon after and haven't looked back. What we healthcare professionals have subjected our patients to during this period is unforgivable, and people must accept responsibility for their decisions. I have sympathy for the pressures many doctors, nurses and allied health workers have faced, but it was no more significant than other workers who found themselves on the receiving end of ridiculous mandates. If anything, we healthcare workers accept a higher burden of responsibility when entering our respective professions and we simply MUST put our ethical obligations above our pay cheques. We may have empathy and compassion for people like this doctor, but we are right to stop short of grouping him/her with those who stood up from the outset at enormous personal and professional expense.
This is sad for everyone. My daughter qualified as a doctor last year. I am proud of her achievement especially as she didn’t get a place at medical school straight away and entered as a mature student. But I continually ask myself what kind of system has she entered. I’ve long avoided conventional medicine deciding that it held no answers for me. I try to take as much responsibility as possible for my own health as I never want to end up in a hospital anywhere let alone the U.K.
I also felt that if the majority of doctors had stood up that this nonsense would have stopped sooner but they didn’t and they haven’t. I feel sorry for everyone who has suffered in a myriad of ways because of this ‘pandemic’. We have all been traumatised in so many ways.
If doctors had stood by their oath this crime against humanity could have been stopped before it got off the ground. No one forced him to comply, he could have made a stand and did the right and good thing. No good crying anonymously now. He knew what he was doing was wrong. Many of us were able to refuse to comply and lost jobs, family, friends etc. It's too late now to cry.
I don’t understand how so many of these comments are so despising and full of hatred. People have families to support and potentially no other option of employment. This is modern slavery people! I commend those who were able to walk away but don’t agree that condemning those who couldn’t is going to help anyone. No one knows this person’s circumstances or if they spoke out within their job? From this article i think it’s highly likely they did!
This is just another version of "I was just following orders". If more doctors, nurses, medical professionals in general had stood on their own two feet, grown a pair, and refused to comply, then the narrative would have collapsed. This may sound harsh, but we used to rely on the doctors, nurses, etc to be truthful, instead of which the majority either believed the lie, or just went along to get along.
In Canada, there are 32 dead doctors, all young in the 24 - 50 age group who went along to get along.
Most trust the system they work for - why wouldn’t they - and it’s been a slow realisation. What’s happening is beyond the comprehension of most - especially healthcare professionals. At least this doctor has spoken out. The fastest way to prevent other doing the same is by posting aggressive comments
Cry me a friggin river. Assuming a gun was not pointed at anyone's head, nobody was forced to do a single thing. The bribes (so-called hazard pay) was all it took for these crimes to be committed. Had they spoken up long ago, those of us who actually have morals and integrity might not have been forced out of our careers.
Without ethics, we are lost. This was a test of our humanity, and tragically, so many of our fellow humans failed - themselves and us. Just as Dr Zimbardo looked on, paralysed with shock as the horrors of his immoral ‘experiment’ were revealed so quickly, so were Governments around the world over the past 2.5 years, drunk with power to cause ‘moral injury’. Now is the time for accountability. Only then can we begin to heal the complex trauma described here. And regain and reclaim, our shared humanity.
Incidentally, the conventional treatment for moral injury would be CBT along the lines of that individuals role in civic duty. So how can the mass formation that led to staff committing these atrocities ever be addressed?
Trouble is, we’ve all been having these imaginary conversations with authority figures for 2.5 years, while being censored, victimised, gaslit and defamed. It’s got to a point where anger would likely overtake any such ‘conversations’ tbh.
Peter Gotzche, 'Deadly Medicines and Organised Crime', 2013.
Malcolm Kendrick 'Doctoring Data', 2014.
Non -medics. who read a lot of material can see that the takeover by the medical-industrial complex has got worse, not better, after every scandal. Medical interventions seem to have been the 3rd. largest cause of death for a long time after heart disease and cancer. If causes of death were more carefully assessed, would pharmaceuticals now be the leading cause?
Oh spare me poor victim - spare us all. If you are told to take actions that you know harm others, and do it anyway because you are 'following orders' in any sense, you make yourself culpable. Claiming you have 'moral injury' afterwards doesn't wash. We make this world, action by action, moment by moment. Many courageous health professionals stood up against this blatant tyranny from the outset. They should be lauded, applauded, and sympathised with. Those who carried on implementing this horror ... to this very day... - not so much. Wake up and grow up springs to mind.
This makes me so angry. No one forces you to go against your conscience. If all the NHS had used their moral compass the jabs would have had to be withdrawn.
I feel angry about this! I lost my job, my 20 year marriage, 99% of my friends AND my family. I now only have my 2 adult children (in their 20's) and one friend in my life. I am a heart beat away from being homeless. This doctor was NOT FORCED just cowardly, weak and immoral.
You’re missing the point. He is describing his working conditions. He’s a doctor whose focus is healing, why would he not continue to help patients? How would walking away help them?
I am so, so sorry you have been through this awful experience and have lost so much. Please know that your stand and your commitment to ethical practice is not only commendable, it is meaningful to a great many people, even if they are people you don't personally know. I wish you the best going forward and I sincerely hope good fortune is just around the corner for you.
The Moral Injury exploration is a tool to demonstrate the full spectrum of harm.
Healthcare staff HAVE BEEN forced to behave in a different way.
Those that realise are too few in number, and need your support.
I respectfully disagree, Edwin. I believe you are correct in your assertion that doctors like the one here are (currently) "too few in number and need (y)our support", but I do not agree they were forced to behave differently. I welcome all healthcare professionals (and indeed all people) who begin to question the appallingly cruel measures taken in the name of pandemic management, but I do not believe that automatically allows them to divorce themselves from their previous involvement, however sad this involvement may make them.
The prison is in their minds.
In this way they are FORCED to behave in ways they can’t even disagree with.
Perhaps you are right, but I don't believe this absolves them of responsibility.
It’s very complicated
They had a responsibility to show up to work for every shift this last three years- and they did… when they weren’t poorly (or assymptomatically poorly…).
There has been no time to take a stand on PPE and isolation.
The battle right now is on the floor, amongst staff members who do not yet perceive anything wrong.
Some doctors did their very best to carry on with well mannered, principled conduct, addressing serious issues in people’s lives. They were overwhelmed with infrastructure and policy .
Keep them onside please
Of course, these sorts of matters usually are. What I am saying, and what I think others here are saying (if I may be so bold as to assume) is that these healthcare workers could have left their jobs rather than participate in these measures in the day-to-day functioning of their roles. I am not suggesting we should not keep such people "on side" as they begin to question or lament the measures, quite the contrary. I am simply acknowledging that regret does not allow a person to undo previous actions. I include myself in this assessment; no one is perfect or blameless, but guilt does not undo past actions. Having said that, I do agree that genuine remorse is a very meaningful position.
No. I will never trust so called doctors again. If those that 'knew' had made a stand then this might have looked different for everyone. Despicable and cowardly. While the rest of us lost everything
How would walking away from the environment help patients? They need doctors like this who have not lost their humanity
Forced how, exactly? Tortured with hot irons? Limbs cut off?
Like this- everybody is tricked into FEELING guilt for their very presence.
Their breath is toxic and they are at risk of the sin of contagion. They have been beaten into infection control submission. They have chosen to avoid anyone else’s personal space. The majority don’t even know it yet.
This called HABITUATION in biology - it’s a form of conditioning which may as well be seen as coercive force.
A mortgage is also a scary gun at your head.
Goodness. How awful if an actual DOCTOR should be homeless or lose their job!!
It’s more that doctors who could actually help you / us will need to move to places like Africa to escape and survive.
I hope you can find a team around you to cope with all the hardship.
Best wishes and thanks for sharing your perspective
To be honest I am exhausted! Along with so many others I have been treated with contempt and hatred for the last few years. I am now picking myself back up mentally, emotionally and physically. I was classed as 'extremely vulnerable' due to not having a spleen and have been treated abominably by my own doctors surgery because I chose to ask appropriate questions. I am in my 50's and I feel like a whole lifetime of trust and belief has been destroyed. If these so called doctors ever get to claim 'moral injury' and get paid for the harm it has done them, I will be beyond furious. I am now a full time carer for my vax injured ex husband who is still asleep to it all!!
I concur with the sentiments expressed here by many people, some of whom have lost everything. I was a nurse in Australia and was utterly horrified by the vast majority of so-called pandemic management measures. I left soon after and haven't looked back. What we healthcare professionals have subjected our patients to during this period is unforgivable, and people must accept responsibility for their decisions. I have sympathy for the pressures many doctors, nurses and allied health workers have faced, but it was no more significant than other workers who found themselves on the receiving end of ridiculous mandates. If anything, we healthcare workers accept a higher burden of responsibility when entering our respective professions and we simply MUST put our ethical obligations above our pay cheques. We may have empathy and compassion for people like this doctor, but we are right to stop short of grouping him/her with those who stood up from the outset at enormous personal and professional expense.
This is sad for everyone. My daughter qualified as a doctor last year. I am proud of her achievement especially as she didn’t get a place at medical school straight away and entered as a mature student. But I continually ask myself what kind of system has she entered. I’ve long avoided conventional medicine deciding that it held no answers for me. I try to take as much responsibility as possible for my own health as I never want to end up in a hospital anywhere let alone the U.K.
I also felt that if the majority of doctors had stood up that this nonsense would have stopped sooner but they didn’t and they haven’t. I feel sorry for everyone who has suffered in a myriad of ways because of this ‘pandemic’. We have all been traumatised in so many ways.
If doctors had stood by their oath this crime against humanity could have been stopped before it got off the ground. No one forced him to comply, he could have made a stand and did the right and good thing. No good crying anonymously now. He knew what he was doing was wrong. Many of us were able to refuse to comply and lost jobs, family, friends etc. It's too late now to cry.
Maybe this doctor didn't comply, and did show the world around them what was happening.
This doctor's not crying, but he may be very sad.
Do we not need them fighting for us on the inside?
Well said
I don’t understand how so many of these comments are so despising and full of hatred. People have families to support and potentially no other option of employment. This is modern slavery people! I commend those who were able to walk away but don’t agree that condemning those who couldn’t is going to help anyone. No one knows this person’s circumstances or if they spoke out within their job? From this article i think it’s highly likely they did!
I agree 100%. The system needs compassionate doctors like this
This is just another version of "I was just following orders". If more doctors, nurses, medical professionals in general had stood on their own two feet, grown a pair, and refused to comply, then the narrative would have collapsed. This may sound harsh, but we used to rely on the doctors, nurses, etc to be truthful, instead of which the majority either believed the lie, or just went along to get along.
In Canada, there are 32 dead doctors, all young in the 24 - 50 age group who went along to get along.
Most trust the system they work for - why wouldn’t they - and it’s been a slow realisation. What’s happening is beyond the comprehension of most - especially healthcare professionals. At least this doctor has spoken out. The fastest way to prevent other doing the same is by posting aggressive comments
Cry me a friggin river. Assuming a gun was not pointed at anyone's head, nobody was forced to do a single thing. The bribes (so-called hazard pay) was all it took for these crimes to be committed. Had they spoken up long ago, those of us who actually have morals and integrity might not have been forced out of our careers.
Without ethics, we are lost. This was a test of our humanity, and tragically, so many of our fellow humans failed - themselves and us. Just as Dr Zimbardo looked on, paralysed with shock as the horrors of his immoral ‘experiment’ were revealed so quickly, so were Governments around the world over the past 2.5 years, drunk with power to cause ‘moral injury’. Now is the time for accountability. Only then can we begin to heal the complex trauma described here. And regain and reclaim, our shared humanity.
Incidentally, the conventional treatment for moral injury would be CBT along the lines of that individuals role in civic duty. So how can the mass formation that led to staff committing these atrocities ever be addressed?
Yes Cognitive Behaviour Therapy is the recommendation!
Look at the referenced Moral Injury document... it advocates for individuals having “imaginary conversations with authority figures”.
Trouble is, we’ve all been having these imaginary conversations with authority figures for 2.5 years, while being censored, victimised, gaslit and defamed. It’s got to a point where anger would likely overtake any such ‘conversations’ tbh.
Totally
Read books like
Peter Gotzche, 'Deadly Medicines and Organised Crime', 2013.
Malcolm Kendrick 'Doctoring Data', 2014.
Non -medics. who read a lot of material can see that the takeover by the medical-industrial complex has got worse, not better, after every scandal. Medical interventions seem to have been the 3rd. largest cause of death for a long time after heart disease and cancer. If causes of death were more carefully assessed, would pharmaceuticals now be the leading cause?
Oh spare me poor victim - spare us all. If you are told to take actions that you know harm others, and do it anyway because you are 'following orders' in any sense, you make yourself culpable. Claiming you have 'moral injury' afterwards doesn't wash. We make this world, action by action, moment by moment. Many courageous health professionals stood up against this blatant tyranny from the outset. They should be lauded, applauded, and sympathised with. Those who carried on implementing this horror ... to this very day... - not so much. Wake up and grow up springs to mind.
Unelected busybodies with agendas will always exist. Weak, feckless and/or paid for politicians are the real problem, they are responsible.